Posted by Catherine on September 28, 19100 at 08:51:26:
In Reply to: Re: A best religion question posted by Philip St. Romain on September 28, 19100 at 07:24:57:
: The Catholic Church's use of the term "fullness of salvation" has many dimensions.
: . . . and I'm sure there are other considerations.
Dear Phil,
Your answer was very helpful. Thank you.
I had some ideas of my own but I guess I was looking for exactly the right idea or the one that the church(es) really teach. One thing your response helped me to realize is that "there are other" ideas and considerations.
When you wrote: "Does this union develop humanity, or, in some cases, occur at the expense of its development?", it made me think of something a Jewish friend told me. But this is unrelated or maybe it is not. I don't know what the proper word is but he told me that the Jews believe that, in order for us to exist and creation, too, that God has to contract somehow because He was already fullness. Whatever the implications are for anyone's doctrine, that was a thought that filled me with awe and made me feel loved.
The ideas that I had, and now I feel that they really have a place in the list you made for me, had to do with things I have been taught on individually directed retreats at our Jesuit novitiate house.
They talk of the greater glory of God all the time. Getting all of this right, even if it had no bearing on my being saved, seems to have a lot to do with giving God the greatest amount of glory possible. This, too, makes my heart glad.
They use some initials for latin words to remind themselves of this goal and I have even seen it on their tombstones when I walk through the cemetary during my retreats.
Another thing I thought about is how all of the religions talk about love and compassion and unity. It does seem our feeling compassionate is one thing but other people receiving or experiencing that compassion is a different matter.
So, when you wrote: ": 2. It can refer to the abundance of gifts, helps, wisdom, etc. in the Church.", this is what I thought about. The more this or that religion can provide, like the greater glory of God, the greatest amount of help and gifts and wisdom, the more compassion people and our planet might experience. Maybe that is not exactly what you were saying but maybe this is just another way of saying it?
I guess my feeling is that just becasue everyone might be in heaven or nirvana and just because some religions claim we are there already, if this church or religion's wisdom can prevent one more Hitler or Mussolini or Stalin, or even just one more wife or child from being abused, well that would be for God's greater glory and our greatest realization of compassion. So, you can see that I think it matters very much that we get these things right.
My director on retreat taught me about the different ways of responding to God's love. Not wanting to be separated from Him in eternity is the first way. And that is the level that makes people, I believe, indifferent about this or that religion or teaching.
But the second way is that, even though I know I am saved, I would not want to hurt Jesus or anyone else or offend them. It seems that people who are indifferent about the first way can not be indifferent about this way.
And the third way is to want to not just be with God and not just to not hurt Him or others but to want to be like Jesus. I don't see how people in other religions can claim that none of this matters because God is already in everyone (or is everyone).
As an example, I don't even judge Hitler but it sure would have been a lot better for a whole lot of people if he would have been a LOT more like Jesus. Someone once said that the difference between Jesus and Hitler was that one was willing and the other one was willful, but that otherwise they both had very strong personalities. That is really something to think about.
One last thing and that is that all of the religions seem to talk about truth and saying the right thing in the right way. Even though we can see things differently between the faiths , when you wrote: "The Church is trying to speak to an age of relativism and political correctness, which views religions with suspicion and considers all to be making claims that are entirely subjective, at best, and self-serving, at worst.", I thought that although all religions have some truth, surely we will find out one day that one of them siad it the best and accomplished the most for the world, not just in saving souls but also in spreading compassion, you know, like I said before, in a way that works and really gets the job done!
: You see, the goal of the Christian life is the divinization of humanity and, indeed, all of creation. Christ alone, we believe, most perfectly incarnates and integrates the human and divine, and the Church is his Mystical Body now in space and time. What the Catholic Church is saying is that the highest development of this divinization process can be found in Catholicism--at least, that's the spiritual/mystical sense of it, rather than the doctrinal/theological, which is not totally separate.
I like what you say about divinization and think of the priest's words during mass about He partook of our humanity that we might share in His divinity. This makes more sense from my real life experiences when I know He made me but I am not feeling too divine sometimes until I return to Him over and over, maybe each time staying longer and growing closer like that Godspell song "Day By Day".
: I hope this makes sense. It's trying to say something about why it's important for Catholics to stay in their Tradition, and why others should consider becoming Catholics
I have heard it said that changing from some traditions to others is really difficult psychologically, like transplanting little plants from one soil or climate to another can be dangerous for the health of the plant. Also, I have heard it said that if you stay in your religion and go deep enough, your roots will touch the roots of the other religions.
Phil, you did help. Thank you for being here. I think your answers confirm some of what I already was feeling.
C. A.