Posted by Johnboy on September 26, 19100 at 08:18:38:
In Reply to: Re: Ways of Perfection: (Tying up Loose Ends) posted by D....oops!...Mary Poppins on September 25, 19100 at 16:43:43:
:So, we are coming to this dialogue from very different places. That affects our perspectives. Keep that in mind. The people we hang out with affect the way we see the world.
: Finally, the topic of thoughts. I have found
: thoughts very important in the spiritual life.
: I was wondering if you had any thoughts on the subject of thoughts and how they affect our lives.
My ability to sneak aside and participate in these serious frivolities waxes and wanes and I am afraid the sun is about to truly set on me as far as time-constraints, but I will say this.
I affirm the characterization of the chakras as paths to God. I affirm the manifold paths as set forth in our great traditions and as discovered by personality psychology, too. I affirm the need to deabsolutize our various means of knowing. I affirm the path of Roman Catholicism as the most perfect articulation of the way to true glory, orthodoxology. I recognize and affirm the truths and goodness found in other traditions. I do not support a false irenicism or facile syncretism between the religions though for that offends Right Speech.
As far as my affective experiences, they are published anonymously and, if you follow most of the links from Shalomplace to the cyberhitherlands, you will find them, some day. They are anonymous for a reason, though.
A wonderful mystical experience I will share is waking up today and having a family, a wife and four beautiful children. Another is knowing that my saying "No" to staying too preoccupied at Shalomplace is a saying of "Yes" to the many other beautiful souls I'm sent to as I leave (from time to time). Another is a wonderful friendship with a Hindu brother who has returned to India every year for about 8 weeks to help improve life there (medically). Several years ago he made a pilgrimage to Sai Baba and brought me some vibhuti, the sweet sacred ash, which I reverently tasted. A couple of months ago, at a mutual friend's funeral, when returning to my pew after communion, I was a little startled to see he had vanished, but rested more easily as I saw him at the altar receiving communion. He returned from communion and joined in our meditation hymn as best he could. I thanked God that my throat chakra had been deprived of the opportunity to counsel my friend on our rules (and this is no commentary on the rules themselves). That was a mystical experience.
You don't hang around forums like this for long without hearing the story of the Chinese farmer, the richest man in the vilage, because he had a horse? And his horse disappears and his fellow villagers arrive to console him: "Too bad about your horse." And he says: "Maybe." And the horse returns with a herd of mustangs and they say:"That's great about those mustangs!" and he says:"Maybe". And his son breaks a leg breaking in a mustang and they say:"Too bad about your son." and he says:"Maybe". And the next day the Emperor impresses all the young men from the surrounding village into military service ... and on and on for 500 verses (like a Johnboy post).
When the 3rd eye asks who I AM and the crown chakra dissolves good and evil and eschews judgement, we see that all shall be well.
I think the wisdom of the sages of all traditions affirms this profound awareness of deep okayness. Part of what gets refracted as each sage returns from this primary encounter with truth, beauty and goodness, is HOW this okayness comes about. THAT things are okay, there can be no doubt.
Our thoughts (maybe 5th chakra stuff) try to articulate the HOW that others may take the path. It is out of compassion for all sentient beings that we elaborate doctrine and dogma, celebrate ritual and liturgy, codify morals and laws. In these articulations of truth, beauty and goodness we make mistakes. There are different perspectives but there ARE real differences, too.
So, let me suggest that one way of looking at good and evil is to refrain from judging exactly what is good and evil. We do this by nurturing mystery and saying: "MAYBE!" This saying of "maybe" helps resolve the theodicy issue and it is one aspect of enlightenment to be able to nurture paradox and accept the unknown. It is why the theodicy issue can even disappear and the saints and mystics rightfully proclaim their "all may be well" anthem.
In answering the question, "HOW" will all things be well, which is okay to ask, necessary even (for it is a viable path, too), there is a BIG difference in saying that good and evil are the very same thing and in saying that we don't always know the difference. There is a BIG difference in saying that sin and mistakes are the very same thing and in saying that we don't always know the difference.
I think I would be correct in saying that Roman Catholic Theology (entering 5th chakra here) is willing to affirm the Chinese farmer's: "MAYBE". When I witness an event, aware of Divine Providence and informed by Romans 8, I know that evil can be transformed and good can be brought out of it. I can look at this or that event from my past and see that judging it as good or evil at the time was misguided (like Garth Brook's song: "Unanswered Prayers"). I can say MAYBE this or that event will result in a good or evil outcome and that, ultimately, ALL will be transformed, however, mysteriously.
So, like the Hindu, we can affirm that all may be well. We don't claim, however, that good and evil are an illusion and we do distinguish between primary causality (God allowing evil) and secondary causality (for instance, a person saying no to love). Those little classics: _Abandonment to Divine Provide__ and __Trustful Surrender to Divine Providence__ do an excellent job of setting forth these workings of God.
We say MAYBE because we don't know, because there IS mystery. Saying MAYBE does NOT mean that good and evil are the same (or don't exist), that sins and mistakes are the same (or don't exist). It just means that we can't always JUDGE good and evil from our limited human perspective and that we shall not judge another human's behavior as regards sin versus illness versus poor formation, etc
So we aren't always just saying the same thing in different ways. We do share compassion and solidarity and a desire for authentic interreligious dialogue and reconciliation.
The presumption is that contemplation attains to love, so thoughts assist us in conveying to others how our prayer might lead to concrete action. Wrong thinking and wrong speech violate the Buddha's prescriptions and St. James' admonitions and Jesus' prohibition against leading little ones astray. I think that unnuanced teachings about sin can lead people into making wrong decisions about very concrete actions, mistakes, so to speak. I also think that some people who are developing the habits of saying no to love in many little life situations can sieze upon erroneous teachings about sin and with increasingly unaligned wills use them to rationalize some very immoral behavior thereby sinning through presumption of God's mercy.
Just as Phil distinguished between one use of the word "intuition" and another, perhaps all we need do is distinguish between one use of the phrase "refraining from judgement" and other uses of it.
That my Hindu brothers and sisters and I agree on the primacy and efficacy of Love, there can be no doubt. That the Hindu Path has salvific efficacy, there is no doubt in my mind. That we are all striving toward the most perfect articulation of Love, there can be no doubt. That Jesus was the definitive statement of the Father, the Mother, is my belief and I share it out of compassion.
maybe,
jb
be back in December